Fire Emblem Genesis

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Nasir vs Ena

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1 Nasir vs Ena on Fri Oct 23, 2009 12:28 am

First, I'd like to emphasize that both characters are very limited in what they can do against generic enemies. Both:

-Have only 2 chapters of availability
-Are limited to 5-6 move
-Have transform issues
-Are restricted to 1 range
-Have trouble 1RKOing

(You'll see why this is important later in my post)

Let's quickly compare their bases, assuming Nasir gets a 2 level BEXP dump while Ena gets 3.

Nasir lv 20: 58 hp, 41 atk, 26 spd, 30 def, 32.5 res
Ena lv 13: 55 hp, 36 atk, 21 spd, 28 def, 27 res

2x Tiger lv 11-12 (claw)
46 hp, 31 atk, 17 AS, 129 hit, 37 avo, 20 def, 9 res, 9 crit, 3 cev

Both 2RKO

8x Raven lv 11-12 (beak)
39 hp, 22 atk, 21 AS, 127 hit, 45 avo, 14 def, 10 res, 8 crit, 3 cev

Nasir will only double if he's transformed without the demi-band. If that's the case, then both 2RKO once again.

1x Warrior lv 12 (steel bow, steel axe)
49 hp, 30 atk, 16 AS, 106 hit, 40 avo, 14 def, 8 res, 7 crit, 8 cev

Nasir has a slight edge here, particularly if Ena doesn't double.

Also keep in mind that while Nasir's level is maxed out, Ena is levelling fairly quickly through CEXP (eg/ the warrior gives roughly 10 exp / hit and 25 / kill), so she'll simply be catching up over time. The same is true if we choose to BEXP her more, which is a distinct possibility since all your primary units should be fully developed already.

Case in point: Nasir undoubtedly wins vs generics, but that lead is mitigated by how little combat exposure either unit is getting as well as how swiftly she can catch up to him statistically.

This leads me to my main point: When considering the Ashnard fight, Ena serves as a much better crutch than Nasir.

See, if we unlocked Nasir, that means Ike was RNG blessed, so he'll be fine to take out Ashnard with resolve (and wrath if it's still available). However, if we unlocked Ena, then no such condition has to be met. Thus if Ike was RNG screwed enough, putting resolve + possibly wrath on her instead will decrease the turn count of the final chapter dramatically.

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2 Re: Nasir vs Ena on Fri Oct 23, 2009 7:27 am

Fixed Growths gaurantees that a non RNG screwed Ike will never exist.

Furthermore, an Aether activation is more necessary to win the BK fight than getting a non screwed Ike.

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3 Re: Nasir vs Ena on Fri Oct 23, 2009 12:26 pm

I agree, the RNG factor in the BK fight is largely with Aether activation, not stats. That means that the dragon you get really has little predictive power with regard to how Endgame plays out. You could have a stat-blessed Ike that gets RNG-screwed on mastery activations, and therefore gets stuck with Ena, but he doesn't necessarily need her for Ashnard.

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4 Re: Nasir vs Ena on Fri Oct 23, 2009 1:48 pm

Fixed Growths gaurantees that a non RNG screwed Ike will never exist.

I thought we were assuming random mode was used.

Furthermore, an Aether activation is more necessary to win the BK fight than getting a non screwed Ike.

The lower Ike's strength is, the more aether activations he's going to need. If Ike is doing 1 damage per hit instead of 9, then the former Ike is relying purely on Aether for the victory. Also, his aether activation can go down dramatically based on his skill stat.

When these factors are weighed against Ike, the chances of Nasir being recruited decrease.

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5 Re: Nasir vs Ena on Fri Oct 23, 2009 1:54 pm

I thought we were assuming random mode was used.

It's never specified, but I see no reason why Fixed Mode wouldn't come into play if you're that worried about getting RNG screwed.



The lower Ike's strength is, the more aether activations he's going to need. If Ike is doing 1 damage per hit instead of 9, then the former Ike is relying purely on Aether for the victory.

@ Bold: Like he is already. There is no foolproof way to beat the BK, you HAVE to rely on luck. Yes, there is a chance Ike may wind up 8 points below his target STR, but even without pretending Bands exist the odds of this are so hilariously low that you may as well nitpick that Titania's spd may become unsalvageable even with KW.

Also, his aether activation can go down dramatically based on his skill stat.

Again, Secret Books.

You know, those things we don't care about selling because we have money out the ass and that nobody else wants anyway.

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6 Re: Nasir vs Ena on Fri Oct 23, 2009 3:34 pm

It's never specified, but I see no reason why Fixed Mode wouldn't come into play if you're that worried about getting RNG screwed.

The way I see it, it's safe to assume the player sometimes plays random, and sometimes plays fixed. Whenever random is played, Ike's stats become relevant to this discussion.

Like he is already.

You're not following me. Let's say Ike has 25 skl. His chances of landing aether twice in 5 attacks is 36.7% whereas it's only 10.4% in 3 attacks. The more aether activations he needs, the less likely it will be that he kills the BK, and by a rather significant amount (in this example it was by a factor greater than 3).

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7 Re: Nasir vs Ena on Fri Oct 23, 2009 5:08 pm

Like you're not following me:

Again, Secret Books.

You know, those things we don't care about selling because we have money out the ass and that nobody else wants anyway.

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8 Re: Nasir vs Ena on Fri Oct 23, 2009 5:21 pm

I thought random mode was already specified? In any case, I think I'd prefer it that way anyway.

bblader1 wrote:Again, Secret Books.
Why are you saying "again" when you never mentioned Secret Books before? At least I never saw you mention them, and you never mentioned before in this topic at least.

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9 Re: Nasir vs Ena on Fri Oct 23, 2009 5:22 pm

wrong figure of speech or something :/

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10 Re: Nasir vs Ena on Sat Oct 24, 2009 12:20 pm

I wouldn't say that Ena being a possible clutch against Ashnard in the case Ike is heavily RNG screwed should mean much as there is such a stupidly small chance that this actually occurs. I would consider being better against generics as superier, especially as he has a doubling lead against 16 of the enemies if not transformed by the demi band, 39 with the Demi band. I can see Nasir/Ena getting a little bit of combat at the very least, especially through the use of ferrying.

Though perhaps they should be put in the same spot, much like Cain and Giffca in the FE10 list in Serenes.

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11 Re: Nasir vs Ena on Sat Oct 24, 2009 2:14 pm

Kirsche wrote:I wouldn't say that Ena being a possible clutch against Ashnard in the case Ike is heavily RNG screwed should mean much as there is such a stupidly small chance that this actually occurs. I would consider being better against generics as superier, especially as he has a doubling lead against 16 of the enemies if not transformed by the demi band, 39 with the Demi band. I can see Nasir/Ena getting a little bit of combat at the very least, especially through the use of ferrying.

Though perhaps they should be put in the same spot, much like Cain and Giffca in the FE10 list in Serenes.

Well, they have a massive durability lead on Lucia, but its 2 chapters versus ~6 chapters. They also have 20 str and 10mt weapons so Ena has 32/35 (35% str growth, 10 levels remain) and Nasir has 35/40 mt. Lucia has a shot at 27mt at base with a runesword, though, and a 30% mag growth. Also she starts with 28mt with a silver sword and if she gets her hands on a forge it can be 33mt and a 50% str growth (8 levels remain). Also crit.

To move Ena closer to Nasir, Ena needs to get past Lucia.

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12 Re: Nasir vs Ena on Sat Oct 24, 2009 3:44 pm

Or Lucia needs to move above Nasir. I certainly can't see what Nasir is doing that Ena isn't, aside from doubling more enemies. But that alone shouldn't cancel out the fact that the main reason Lucia > Ena is the fact that Lucia has 3* her availability.

So yeah I agree with Lucia > Nasir or Ena > Lucia.

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13 Re: Nasir vs Ena on Wed Oct 28, 2009 3:21 pm

Kirsche wrote:So yeah I agree with Lucia > Nasir or Ena > Lucia.


Does anybody have any comments? I'm not sure what to do with Lucia, Nasir, and Ena.

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